A New War on Drugs
Part 2 of My Interview with John Hinckley Jr.
M: Okay. Umm- I’m wondering if you can tell me a bit about your mother?
JHJ: Well she- she was a wonderful woman and she passed umm July 30th, 2021. I was her caregiver for the last five years of her life.
M: Mm.
J: Living with her as her caregiver. But yeah I was close to her for- I mean, for as long as she was alive.
M: Yeah.
J: I mean I was her son.
M: Yeah. Um, I know that your siblings are still around. Um, do you have close relationships with them?
J: Yeah. I talk to my sister- she’s in Dallas, Texas with her own family uh- I talk to her on a regular basis [clears throat] my brother lives in New Jersey-
M: Okay.
J: To be close to his daughter- I talk, you know, I talk to them too. He came to visit not long ago.
M: Oh nice. Um- has that been- I mean your, like, your relationship with them- has that been a, I guess an important- I’m assuming that’s been an important factor in your recovery.
J: Oh, sure, yeah, my family stood behind me one hundred percent-
M: Yeah.
J: My father, mother, brother, and sister.
M: That’s incredible, genuinely.
J: [laughs]
M: Um, I know that they started a foundation, um, at some point. Is that still around?
J: No my, my father started the- I think it was called The American Mental Health Fund.
M: Yes.
J: And that went for a number of years but he eventually- Um, I don’t know what he did with it- I think it merged into- into a bigger organization.
M: Okay.
J: So that, that name is no longer around.
M: Mhm, okay, um-[pause] hm hm hm. Okay, can you tell me-
J: Can I ask- can I ask you a question?
M: Sure.
J: I’ve heard- you know I’ve heard of what- of Substack- tell me what it is.
M: Em- it’s just a platform to post writing, uh- that people will see more easily than if you had, like, a website of your own where you, like, send out newsletters or anything. Um- so yeah it’s pretty, like- I don’t know it’s like longer form Twitter, uh, potentially. Um, so yeah it’s just a way to get writing out. Um- and, yeah disseminate it pretty well, uh-
J: Now how would I- how would I see what you’ve put up?
M: Um, I’ll send you my stuff. And I’ll send you a copy of what I will post as well before I post it. Um, just to make sure everything’s okay with you. Um- could you tell me about your time in the psychiatric hospital? How did you spend your days there?
J: [slow inhale] Well, it was many years, and I just- I, you know, I- I went to a lot of groups, and, um, in about 1998 or 99, I started taking care of cats.
M: Okay.
J: When I was out- when I was out on my grounds privileges. Um, I started taking care of cats, and it became like a big colony of cats after a while. And I worked with another lady, and we got all the cats spayed and neutered and vaccinated and, uh, it took a little- a good amount of my time, but it helped get me through my days there-
M: Yeah. Yeah, that makes sense.
J: So, yeah.
M: What is your, um, I know you make art of your cat now- what is your cat’s name?
J: Theo.
M: Theo. Okay cute. How old is he?
J: He’s- he’ll be eight in April.
M: Oh. And that is your only pet?
J: He’s a rescue, yeah, I got- I got- when I first got my release, one of the first things I did was go to the Humane Society and- Theo. [knocks]
M: Has he been a- has he uh-
J: He’s my only pet, yeah.
M: Yeah, how has, uh, having him around impacted you?
J: Oh! He’s kinda, kinda the center of my life and my day, you know, he- everything- I don’t know if you’re a cat lover or not but, um, he’s- you know, cats [pause] do everything on their own terms, and I just, you know, he’s my companion all day long.
M: Mm. Cool. Um- so I know that you were diagnosed with narcissistic personality disorder, um- do you see that as affecting your day to day now?
J: No.
M: No?
J: Not at all.
M: Em- can you tell me a little bit more about that?
J: [inhale] Well, I mean, as the years went on, even the courts were saying that my, my narcissism was diminished to almost nothing.
M: Okay.
J: You know I don’t feel like I have, you know, a narcissistic personality. Now, other than what- you know, I think everybody has somewhat of a narcissistic personality if they have any, any self esteem-
M: Sure.
J: Um, it certainly is, is- they used the word attenuated a lot. Uh, narcissism has- attenuated, meaning, um, that it diminished over the years.
M: Okay. Um, do you feel- how do you feel that your mental health is now?
J: Oh, it’s- I don’t- I think I’m- I think I’m very, uh, healthy mentally.
M: Do you feel like that has continued to progress over the years? Or- yeah how has that- I guess, kind of take me through maybe timeline of when you first start- first felt that starting to shift and where you are now?
J: Well, I think- as I said, I- I met a woman named Leslie in 1982 when I was at the hospital-
M: Mhm.
J: Early- early in my stay and she kinda brought me back to reality and, uh, that’s when I started my recovery.
M: Okay.
J: Yeah, 1982.
M: 1982. Um, do you still take medication now?
J: I do.
M: Okay. Em- could you tell me how you felt after learning of Brady’s death?
Pause.
J: I can’t really speak to that. I mean, I’d rather not get into all that.
M: Okay. That’s fine. Um, hm- have you ever thought about changing your name?
Pause.
J: Um, I’ve had, I’ve had some people tell me you know, if- you know, some musicians, they go by like a band name or just another name. People have told me I should do that maybe. But, um, you know I’ve not done it, but [inaudible]
M: Why do you think- why haven’t you done it?
J: I think, you know, I think it would pretty quickly get eventually known who I actually am even if I went by a pseudonym or a band name-
M: Yeah.
J: It would very quickly be known who I am.
M: Yeah. Um, so, with all of these venues, em, kind of dragging their feet and then eventually canceling your shows, um, could you tell me how the communication has been with you around this?
J: [inhale] I’ve had about ten or twelve or fifteen venues cancel on me. Uh, what happens is they- they book me into a venue, and then we announce the show, and I think they start rece- the venue starts receiving negative backlash-
M: Mhm.
J: And, uh, they- they, they back out. This happens- this has happened over and over.
M: Yeah.
J: Um, now this latest, this latest one that happened I was scheduled to play a show in Connecticut at the end of this month-
M: Yeah.
J: But they stood behind me all the way. It was- the problem with this ven-, uh, [knocks] show is- their venue has some co- some code violations, uh, the building inspector wants them to fix the code violations. Um, so that’s why we had to postpone it, but the people who own that venue are, are- support me one hundred percent.
M: Do you think that they would reschedule the show after the violations are-
J: Yes, they will-
M: Okay.
J: I think it’s- I think once the code violations, you know, taken care of- I think it’ll be rescheduled.
M: Okay. Um, [pause] if you could, em, [sharp exhale] so, it sounds to me like you feel that you are rehabilitated, um, it seems evidentially that you are, um, do- if you could, I guess, like, perfect world, um, how would you like to be treated? [laughs]
Pause.
J: Well, I mean I’m treated- I’m treated well here in Williamsburg. That’s why I live here is cause people kinda, you know, don’t bother me here, and I- I’m able to live a quiet life here. I- I’m always gonna have my reputation, you know-
M: Mhm.
J: From as far back as 1981-
M: Yeah.
J: I’ve had a lot of negative things said about me, and so there’s a lot of feelings out there and if pe- if people care about me at all, they have strong opinions of me, either positive or negative. Um, I- what I, what I’m seeing is the older generation- the parents and the grandparents, uh, think of me in more harsh terms-
M: Mhm.
J: Whereas young people-
M: Mhm.
J: Are my fans-
M: Mhm.
J: I would say my fanbase is about ninety-five or ninety-nine percent young people in their early twenties-
M: Yeah.
J: Late teens, early twenties. Because they don’t have the prejudices that their parents and grandparents have about me.
M: Yeah. And what would you- if you could put words to what the- what those prejudices are, uh, what would those be?
J: Well, they’re just- the, the older people are just unforgiving, you know-
M: Mm.
J: They- they don’t wa- they don’t want to think about me as a changed person-
M: Yeah.
J: From the way I was back then. They- they just keep the prejudice of the way that I was back then, whereas the young people have no preconceived notions about me- they just like my music.
M: Hm.
J: Or my- or my art.
M: Yeah.
J: And that- that’s my fanbase.
M: Yeah. Yeah, um, do-do-do- how- going out in public, um, could you- do you ever have any feelings of agoraphobia? Do you ever feel paralyzed? Em, how do you feel when you go out and about?
J: Well, I’m not bothered, um, here. I mean, when people c- people recognize me sometimes and they’ve always very fr- they’re always friendly-
M: Okay.
J: They just wanna talk to me for a little bit and maybe get a picture with me or something like that but [inaudible]
M: Okay [laughs] do you mind when they do that?
J: No, I don’t mind that.
M: Um, [pause] oh sorry, um, when was the last time you left Williamsburg? You said you- did your brother come to visit you? Or-
J: Yes, he did.
M: Okay. When was the last time you left Williamsburg?
J: [inhale] Uh, after my release I would have to go up to D.C. once a month to check in to the outpatient department-
M: Okay.
J: So, I would go to D.C., but I, you know, that stopped a while back, um, so the last place I been to out of town out of Williamsburg [inhale] and, you know, the local, you know, areas around here would be D.C..
M: Okay. And when was the last time you did that?
J: Um, it was after I got my- my convalescent leave from the hospital, and we just w- and the court order was that I had to go up there once a month-
M: Mhm.
J: To check in. But that stopped about [pause] I don’t know, five or six years ago.
M: Okay. Cool. Um- and then, could you just walk me through what a normal day for you is like now?
J: Well, I just- I just, uh, work on my music, work on my art. I sell my paintings on eBay sometimes. Um, I come up with my songs, I put them on- put em out on the streaming services.
M: Okay.
J: Uh, I have an album out now, a vinyl album out called Redemption that is s- actually sold out. They’re- they’re having to, uh, do another pressing of it.
M: Is that available anywhere? Or do you sell that-
J: It’s available- it’s available all over the place.
M: Okay awesome. Cool. Um- okay, I think that is pretty much it. Um, is there anything else you would like to say before we wrap up?
J: No, it was just nice talking to you, and you know- send me, uh, send me what you write.
M: Yeah, definitely. Uh, yeah, thank you so, so much. I really appreciate it. Um, and I hope you have a great rest of your day.
J: Well, you too.
M: Thanks! Bye.
J: Talk to y-
Thanks for reading! My reflection on the interview and all that’s come afterwards will be out next Sunday.